Tan Kin Lian's Blog: Speaker's Corner, Saturday 11 October, 5

Sunday, October 05, 2008

Speaker's Corner, Saturday 11 October, 5 - 7 pm

CONFIRMED:
Venue: Speaker's Corner, Hong Lim Green
Date: Saturday 11 October from 5 to 7 pm.
Topic: Petition to Singapore Government on Credit Linked Securities.

Speakers:
1. Tan Kin Lian
2. Leong Sze Hian

As a large crowed is expected, it may not be possible for some investors to hear the speakers. The authority allow a loud hailer to be used, but not a powered loudspeaker. I will keep my speech short and give a handout to people who are not able to hear me.

Signs will be put up for the attendees to meet other investors who have invested in similar products, e.g. Minibond, High Notes, Pinnacle Notes, Jubilee Notes. The main purpose of this event is to show a large gathering of investors.

75 comments:

Anonymous said...: Mr Tan,

We will go and support you! Our family of 5. My kids can help to pass leaflets too! See you.; September 30, 2008 10:22 AM
Anonymous said...: Yeah, please invite the press as well.; September 30, 2008 11:46 AM
ym said...: mr tan, can you tell this joke??..
conversation between someone and his wife... :)

hubbie : lost of life savings 50k?
wife : that's peanuts..

hubbie : lost of child education fund 25k?
wife : that's peanuts..

hubbie: my buddy bankers and tennis partners need to cough out 1bil!?
wife : oh that's just nuts..; September 30, 2008 1:16 PM
Anonymous said...: Mr Tan,

you have our full support. Singapore needs people like you: Stand up for ordinary Singaporean.

Chen; September 30, 2008 1:19 PM
Anonymous said...: Mr. Tan, You are doing it for a good course!!!!

You have not answer my question why some of the people signed the petition are marked "Pending approval". What approval is that?; September 30, 2008 2:07 PM
PoonCM said...: Mr Tan,
Thank you for all the good work done.
Maybe those affected could take this opportunity to meet one another. Different area labeled according to different investment type could be set so that people with the same type of investment could meet and discuss.; September 30, 2008 2:14 PM
tulipfashion said...: Dear Mr Tan ,
We'll go and surport you , once again thanks for everything . Singapore need more people like YOU .; September 30, 2008 3:37 PM
Anonymous said...: Thank you Mr Tan. I will be there to support u. It really touches me that u are helping so many people who are strangers to u.; September 30, 2008 9:15 PM
Anonymous said...: This should be the biggest turnout at Speaker's Corner..; September 30, 2008 9:27 PM
Anonymous said...: Dear Mr Tan

I m sorri, i used to laugh when I saw u on TV when u were CEO of NTUC, tot u looked funni when u speak with yr eyebrows constantly raised.

I will try not to laugh when i c in person n my entire extended family will b there once my baby wakes up from her afternoon nap.

You r the only "voice" for the ordinary folks.

thank u :); September 30, 2008 10:50 PM
Anonymous said...: wilson tan, suggest you look at the comments in the Petition thread.

pooncm, I second your suggestion. Another way is to bring together the members of the email groups.; October 01, 2008 12:50 AM
Anonymous said...: Mr Tan,

Good. Another avenue and step forward to be heard. Hope you will progress to speak at an election rally, but not on a PAP platform, of course. And there is still time to organise and prepare for this. Mr Tan, do consider it for a bigger impact. Singapore sorely needs more people like you to form a credible alternative for the good of the country.; October 01, 2008 2:37 AM
Anonymous said...: I appeal to everyone to get your friends and relatives and turn out at the speaker's corner. As long as we are not rowdy or violent and not chanting anti-government slogans, we wil do fine. We must not let the government thinks that only 1000 people (0.0002% of Singapore population) are involved. Sheer numbers count!Many unaffected Singaporeans also care for their loved ones who are badly affected. Let's hope for a big turn-out. Enough to jolt MAS into REAL action!; October 01, 2008 11:12 AM
Anonymous said...: Hi Mr Tan
I plan to be there too. I urge all affected people, have courage to show up and don't live up to the impression of people outside S'pore: "S'porean are too kiasi to stand up for issue even when they are robbed of their life savings". Be like HongKongers and other Asians, Unity is Strength!

Benedict; October 01, 2008 6:55 PM
Anonymous said...: Can we gather the efforts of the HK and Taiwan authorities for their Minibond victims to share with MAS and Singapore government? This should help them understand these authorities are having issues with the Minibond as well and how they can protect their people.; October 01, 2008 10:19 PM
Unknown said...: Hi Mr Tan

It is fortunate that a retired CEO like you championing this good cause. Many ordinary folks have benefited through your blog including myself. I shall mark this date and hope more will be alerted of this type of dubious product sales.; October 01, 2008 10:20 PM
Anonymous said...: Dear Mr. Tan,

Thank you for everything...I will be there to give all my support.; October 02, 2008 6:10 PM
GOHCT said...: Mr.Tan,

Don't worry that some of them talk back about you. Just do what you think you are RIGHT.

I will give you the FULL Support; we really need MORE people like you in Singapore. I know that a lot of them just stand and wait for miracle to happen. That will not be happened unless someone needs to speak out LOUD and CLEAR.

Time has changed. Everything is possible now.; October 02, 2008 8:09 PM
Ang said...: thank you for your. We will go and support you; October 02, 2008 10:16 PM
Ang said...: Mr Tan
I am very anxious to join in signing the partition as i have invested 50K in the minibond series 9. But my no.866 is under pending. What should i do.
Thanks; October 02, 2008 10:20 PM
J.Quek said...: Dear Mr Tan,

Thank you for your effort. We greatly appreciate what you have done for us.We will surely come to support you. I will get my family & friends to come too. How can we let our hard-earned saving (which is for my kids education) just gone down the drain so easily? Thanks for helping us,ordinary folks like us.; October 03, 2008 2:55 PM
Anonymous said...: Dear Kin Lian,
YOUR GUTS to speak up for the FINANCIALLY BURNT Investors are admirable.You make those sitting in the IVORY TOWER look small and useless!!! We will gather as many people, regardless of whether they are 'burnt' or not to go listen. So that the general public will be aware of whats going on BEHIND A BEAUTIFULLY PAINTED PICTURE OF SINGAPORE.; October 03, 2008 4:32 PM
Anonymous said...: Dear Kin Lian,
Your intention to speak at the Speaker's Corner on 11 Oct is commendable. I strongly support your action for a noble cause. My friends, neighbours and I will help mobilise other affected investors to attend the event. See you there.
Gan Cheong Chor; October 03, 2008 4:41 PM
Anonymous said...: Mr. Tan,

We support you whole heartedly. You show how a leader should function...without pay! Your blog should be circulated widely to show we are a united nation.; October 03, 2008 9:41 PM
Anonymous said...: This is going to be the biggest gathering ever at hong lim park. If possible, bring along some protest signboards like what the hongkong people did.; October 04, 2008 1:00 AM
Anonymous said...: S'pore c.bank can't force banks to compensate investors
Reuters - Friday, October 3SINGAPORE, Oct 2 - Singapore's central bank said on Thursday that it DID NOT HAVE THE POWER TO FORCE banks to compensate retail investors who bought structured products linked to failed U.S. investment bank Lehman Brothers.

Have right to approve these products worth few Billions and sell in here but cannot force banks to compensate retail investors. Not sure what theory is this.

For sure, we cannot remain in silent again.; October 04, 2008 12:21 PM
Anonymous said...: I will be there to support.
As many others have commented, I too feel that many s'poreans are kiasi and fearful to speak up about any issue even privately, much less to show up and voice publicly.; October 04, 2008 4:14 PM
Henry said...: Mr Tan Kin Lian is the one of the few good man with public spirit left in S'pore. I had a car accident some years back when he was still the CEO of Income. After submitting my claim for 2 weeks, the staff drag their feet and refused to resolve my claim in an expedient way. I got angry after 2 weeks and wrote to Mr Tan. Within 30 minutes he responded with an email and assured me that my claim had been settled. Wow, you see how he can make a difference compared to our civil servant. That's why all my 6 policies are with Income, no other companies. When I heard of his departure, I was very disappointed and wish him well. Sincere thank you and keep up with what you are doing, Mr Tan. There's nobody else that we can turn to, MM, SM, PM, MP, none wants to help, too busy..I am not sure if MAS rec'd any "application fees" when they approve those products for sale?
My family and me will be there to support you on Saturday.; October 04, 2008 10:22 PM
Anonymous said...: Juz wondering : How can any agency have the power to approve certain products & not assume responsiblity when their approved products harmed innocent people?? Before approving , isn't it the duty of the appointed agency to make sure everything is ok before allowing any products to be launched to the public???
This just goes to say.... authority-in-charge just signed blindly on the approval form OR they were also misled by the products like all the other affected investors...
In any of these cases, can we , investors claim against the authority for negligence instead??

Will certainly be at the Speakers Corner to support Mr.Tan.

"GOOD JOB DONE MR.TAN"; October 04, 2008 10:59 PM
Anonymous said...: A very sad day for Sgp financial hub. Banks says it is not their fault and hide behind the prospectus. Investors were con into believing this product is as safe as FD. I know, I am one of them. Everytime a hugh deposit is withdrawn or account close, the bank CONsultant will approach and market products. The fact is the risk was not explained, where the money was invested were not explain and earning commission takes precedent instead of fit the risk appetite of investors. Hong Kong investors were also having the same problem. In Sgp, no MPs speak out for us, no opposition speak up for us. I am very sure some of them lost in this product but don't dare to talk about it as it looks stupid or too rich and write it off.

All emails to the top redirected to MAS. MAS says they can only fine banks if only proven and ask us to take it up with FIDRC or court. Where is the heart for the heartlanders? If you earn $24k a year not $2 million, this lost is hugh. It got worst if it is your 10-20 years of saving. Let's pray for a miracle and so far Mr Tan is the only hope we have. As for the Banks, Govt, MAS, I think it has become THEY against US....; October 05, 2008 8:04 AM
Anonymous said...: Mr Tan,

You are doing a good cause. Keep it up. Will support you at Hong Lim.; October 05, 2008 9:13 AM
WY said...: I hope it can be in different languages so that folks who doesn't understand English can understand what happens.

Also wish there will be recorded voice clips and "presentation" to be available in internet for peoples who couldn't attend.

Video clips on Youtube may raise privacy concerns, otherwise I wish there will be video clips on Youtube.; October 05, 2008 2:49 PM
Anonymous said...: It is very unfortunate that the general election is not around the corner. Otherwise all the MPs would be busy hearing our sad stories with much media coverage.; October 05, 2008 6:33 PM
Wealth Journey said...: Due to the poor infrastructure available at Hong Lim, I'm sure the huge turnout will not be able to capture the essense of the discussion.

Would it be possible for the committee to explore relaying the discussion thru' an FM or AM transmitter and the audience can tune in to it using their phone's radio. I'm sure the police would not notice it....; October 05, 2008 6:39 PM
Anonymous said...: My dad asked me about the Lehman Issue. He felt so sorry for those who had been deceived by the bank of their life savings. I put on a brave front and just smiled and agreed with him.

Little does he know that his daughter is also one of the victims. If I had told him, I know he would be heartbroken for me.

Where is justice? Where is truth?; October 05, 2008 10:06 PM
Anonymous said...: is loudspeaker allowed to be used at hong lim park?; October 05, 2008 10:22 PM
Anonymous said...: Mr. Tan,

The turn out at the Speakers' corner must represent a good cross section of those burnt by the products. The Ah Soh and Ah Peh who can't read properly should be notified. So the first turn-out should have the news reporters there. Announce a 2nd turnout so that these poor folks know that there is a mass of people they can look up to with you as the leader. Have a few good dedicated lawyers like David Gerald there.

Good job, Mr. Tan. You do have the look of a strong leader. We need you. Nowadays, good leaders for good causes have take low profile.; October 05, 2008 10:34 PM
Unknown said...: The irony of it all! In US, borrowers who have defaulted in their loans resulted in the collapse of the lenders. Lenders are blamed for the collapse but all the same the government bailed out the lenders.

In Singapore, savers (like me), who have obediently answered the call by the government to save to provide for our retirement stand to lose all or substantial part of that retirement fund are being told that it is our own fault for (1) not understanding the thick prospectus littered with technical jargon; and
2) not disbelieving the bank's representatives and agents when they told us they are safe investments.

After all, we must be morons to proceed with these risky investments even after being told by the banks that they are risky. (Well, the banks must have been truthful and told us they are risky, right?)

Moral of the story? Borrow, don't save.; October 06, 2008 6:25 AM
Anonymous said...: I will definitely be there!

Please note that we are there not to support Mr Tan i.e. this is really about us. Mr Tan is kindly providing the leadership which we ourselves are lacking. Please be there for ourselves, and be prepared to take the necessary actions and do the necessary hard work to get redress. When the time comes, be prepared to speak up. Looks like no one else (except Mr Tan) will do it for us.; October 06, 2008 9:59 AM
Anonymous said...: Last night's Money Mind over CNA featured Mr Leong Sze Hian - the one who will be sharing with us his expertize with Mr Tan Kin Lian. Just pray that the weather on that day will be fine,everyone in the working team will be in good health and we will have a fruitful afternoon at the Speakers' Corner.; October 06, 2008 12:40 PM
Anonymous said...: Mr.Tan
No matter rain or shine we all would go down and show our support for your fight for the people who are now suffering the deep losses of their hard earn money.; October 06, 2008 2:06 PM
Anonymous said...: HSBC (SEHK: 0005, announcements, news) – the trustee of Lehman Brothers minibonds and other banks who helped distribute them – have showed a positive response to government suggestions they buy back Lehman Brothers minibonds from holders, Financial Secretary John Tsang Chun-wah on Monday....

http://www.scmp.com/portal/site/SCMP/menuitem.2c913216495213d5df646910cba0a0a0/?vgnextoid=c7dab40ae21dc110VgnVCM100000360a0a0aRCRD&vgnextfmt=teaser&ss=Hong+Kong&s=News; October 06, 2008 7:30 PM
Anonymous said...: a word of warning:

there're still many rubbish products out there. If the consultant (be it insurance co, banks or IFA) is unable to explain the pros n cons in layman terms, DON'T INVEST.; October 06, 2008 10:19 PM
Anonymous said...: Dear Mr Tan Kin Lian,

I do have an archive of email from DBS's RM stating the following for DBS HN2

quotes

"DBS High Notes 2 or the Notes are 5-year structured “first-to-default” credit linked notes designed for defensive investors seeking enhanced yield by providing exposure to a basket of highly rated regional and international banks (the “Reference Entities”), each with a minimum credit rating of A- by Standard & Poor’s (see table below). The Maturity Date of the Notes is scheduled to occur 5 years after the Issue Date, with the Issuer having an option to redeem the Notes early at par plus accrued interest 3.5 years following the Issue Date.

ABN Amro Bank NV
Bank of Tokyo-Mitsubishi UFJ Ltd
Deutsche Bank AG
HSBC Bank Plc
Malayan Banking Bhd
Overseas-Chinese Banking Corp Ltd
Standard Chartered Plc
United Overseas Bank Ltd"

unquotes

Does the statement "designed for defensive investors" help in justfication of mis-representation to the product ?; October 07, 2008 12:06 AM
Anonymous said...: 八成雷曼苦主有望退款60%

(綜合報道)

(星島日報報道)雷曼迷你債券風波出現突破性進展。政府建議，由分銷銀行及經紀行回購客戶手上的迷你債券，讓苦主盡快取回款項，解決這場擾攘多時的迷債紛爭。建議亦要求銀行在未來出售迷債抵押品時，如獲得盈餘，須將所賺金額退回給苦主。消息透露，中銀香港、渣打銀行及東亞銀行已對建議作出正面回應。儘管接受回購，苦主難取回全部本金，市場消息人士估計，總值近一百二十六億元的迷你債券中大部分有望取回平均六至七成的本金。

　　財經組記者：劉思敏

　　財經事務及庫務局局長陳家強認為，由分銷銀行向客戶回購迷你債券是「最好的方法」，除了可省卻漫長的清盤程序，讓苦主盡快取回金額外，建議亦要求銀行在未來出售迷債抵押品時，如獲得盈餘，須將所賺金額退回給苦主。分銷銀行可選擇不回購，但政府希望所有銀行都同意建議，並在下星期作出答覆，是否向投資者回購，由於銀行需時決定回購價錢，希望苦主可在今年內收到款項。

　　港府昨日與雷曼迷你債券分銷銀行及經紀行開會，已取得信託人同意，向分銷機構提供迷債抵押品資料，並建議分銷機構根據資料作估值，向持有人回購迷你債券。財政司司長曾俊華表示，十六家分銷銀行中，已得到數家銀行正面回應，而消息透露，該數家銀行包括中銀香港、渣打銀行及東亞銀行，據悉均反應積極。

　　籲日後獲利亦退回苦主

　　這次建議僅針對雷曼迷你債券，並不包括迷債以外其他與雷曼相關的產品。雷曼迷你債券共有三十六隻系列，總值約一百二十五億七千萬元。

　　市場消息人士估算，按價值計，大部分持有人（約佔八成）平均有望取回六至七成本金，不過其他迷債因抵押品為雷曼票據或美國債保商MBIA票據，在市場價值暴跌下，持有人可取回金額應不足五成，甚至接近零。

　　建議傾向由銀行向各自客戶進行回購，但回購估值冀保持統一，客戶可選擇是否接受回購。

　　數家大銀行反應積極

　　不過陳家強提醒，如果按照原來的清盤程序，估計需耗時半年至一年，何況有迷你債券的派息期限要等到明年三月，即約半年後因未能履行派息觸發違約，才能啟動贖回及清盤程序，可謂相當繁複。而且投資者要到完成清盤，才能知道收回多少。所以由分銷銀行向客戶回購是最好方法。

　　陳家強：省繁複清盤程序

　　不少迷債苦主紛紛投訴銀行的不當銷售手法，但即使銀行答應回購，亦不代表可以「甩身」，將涉嫌不當銷售的責任一筆勾銷。陳家強表示，不當銷售的違規行為會另作獨立處理，銀行不會因答應回購而免除責任，投資者接受回購同時，仍可保留追究不當銷售的權利。相關新聞刊A4版; October 07, 2008 8:48 AM
Anonymous said...: Let us vote Mr Tan Kin Lian as our next People's President for the Republic of Singapore.

I will be the 1st to cast my vote for President Tan.; October 07, 2008 3:32 PM
Anonymous said...: It is quite clear that most of the investors purchased the structured product thinking (misled?) that the products were low risk investments. Why can't the MAS makes a stand on this issue?; October 07, 2008 5:40 PM
Anonymous said...: There are 2 more news from Hong Kong newspaper that's not in this blog.
1. Macau government will help their investors by following what HK did.
2. Chairman of HK MAS mentioned he will not let the banks off, for those 20 case that so far has been proven the banks at fault. More cases are being investigated. Good new in HK everyday, what about "first world" S'pore?
Has anyone has any contacts with the Hong Kong, Macau or Taiwan journalists. Invite them to cover this Saturday's event, cast shame on those who can approve but have no back bone to stand up for their mistake or even help. They know that most S'porean are kiasi or don't have the resources to take legal actions, and most will just treat it as a nightmare and let it rest.; October 07, 2008 10:19 PM
Anonymous said...: Count on Me! I will be at the Speakers Corner!
I just wish to ANTICIPATE any events/behaviour that may render the assembly as "UNLAWFUL" resulting in Premature Termination of the gathering by the Police.
Can somebody "in the know" advise the DO's and DON'Ts of public assembly, so it remains as "ORDERLY" and "LAWFUL". Eg can we bring BANNERS, can we CHANT?
Pray for Good Health of the Speakers, Good Weather, Enormous Turnout, and Justice to Prevail.; October 08, 2008 12:38 AM
Anonymous said...: But no news for Merrill Lynch Jubilee Series 3 Notes yet.

SINGAPORE -(Dow Jones)- Singapore’s central bank said Tuesday that Lehman Brothers Holding Inc. (LEH) has defaulted on an issue of bonds sold to local investors.

The Monetary Authority of Singapore said in a statement that the trustee for the Minibonds will consider finding a counterparty to replace Lehman Brothers.

The trustee said if it doesn’t find a counterparty arrangement it will liquidate the bonds and pay the proceeds to bondholders.

Holders of the Lehman bonds include retail investors who have asked the central bank for help in recouping their investments.; October 08, 2008 8:29 AM
Anonymous said...: Thanks Mr Tan for bringing more awareness to the plight that we faced as there seemed to be no avenue of help available for us to recover at least part of our hard earned savings. For my case, the relationship manager of the bank advised me to invest in minibonds when my fixed deposit matured. The money is part of my retirement funds and it hurts to see the money disappear. Especially when at time of purchase, the bank stressed that it was a bond that I am investing and there is no mention of the investment in a structured product.; October 08, 2008 11:09 AM
Anonymous said...: Even though MAS announced there is a possibilities will have a new replace of Lehman Brother as arranger in Singpore. But our family prefer take back our full amount of our funds take the risk. Since that is not as safe as we though at first. I guess we could not sleep in peace until we get back all our money. Is that possible..? We will be at speaker corner this saturday, I hope others victims will do the same.. Thank you thank you very much Mr.Tan.; October 08, 2008 5:11 PM
Anonymous said...: Dear Mr Tan
Keep up the good work. This is one scenario whereby we see how our regulator/authorities work - 'tai chi' to the banks etc to find solution. To give confidence to Singaporeans they should take full control of the situation afterall they are the ones who approved the sale of these products, Right.
Mr Tan - do extend your Sat session to the Media both press and TV. It is time our regulator should 'wake up'.; October 08, 2008 6:45 PM
Anonymous said...: just received a note from Jubilee Finance and Merrill Lynch with the calculation of the final liquidation value of the Jubilee Series 3.

Jubilee Series 3 Notice to Investors

First of all, how it works is that in the case of any default, you (the noteholder), will give up the underlying security of your Jubilee Notes and take over the bonds of the default entity.

The bonds of the default entity (in this case Lehman Brothers), will be sold.

These were sold for about $4.7 million, representing 18% of the original value of the notes.

There is also a need to deduct any costs involved in unwinding all the swap positions. This works could to be $2.6 million.

The last adjustment that needs to be made is in the value of the underlying securities. Any drop or gain in the value of the underlying securities will have to be offset against the proceeds.

In this case, the underlying securities had a market value of only $5.4 million out of the original principal of $26.3 million. This means a markdown of almost $20.8 million.

4.7 - 2.6 - 20.8 = -18.7 million

Jubilee Series 3 noteholders will therefore get back nothing.

This looks like a worse deal than just holding the Lehman bonds directly. Bond holders were getting a coupon of 5.625% and when Lehman defaulted, they could still get back 18% of their capital.

Jubilee noteholders had to undertake a lot more risks and were not being paid a lot more than pure bond holders.; October 08, 2008 6:54 PM
GOHCT said...: Minibond investors demand full refund

Alfred Liu

Wednesday, October 08, 2008

Lehman Brothers minibond holders are demanding a full refund of their money following the government's proposal that banks buy back the failed US investment bank's minibonds from investors.
The Hong Kong government on Monday proposed that 19 distributor banks and brokerage firms buy back minibonds from clients at market value to shorten the painful process of individuals recovering their money and limit reputational damage to banks.

About 50 investors attended a Democratic Party meeting yesterday to discuss the proposal.

Some minibond holders said they would not be happy if they can only get back 60 to 70 percent of their investment and insisted on a 100 percent refund. They also blamed the government for lacking supervision of investment products.

The investors said they will continue to pursue legal action on the marketing practices of the banks promoting Lehman minibonds.

Undersecretary of Financial Services and the Treasury Bureau Julia Leung Fung-yee reiterated yesterday that banks "are not exempted from the investigation on marketing practices even if they are willing to buy back."

The government expects distributors to look at the proposal and assess its potential risks before deciding within a week on whether to accept.

Investors will separately meet Bank of China (Hong Kong) (2388) representatives and lawmakers at the Legislative Council today.; October 08, 2008 7:18 PM
Anonymous said...: Dear Mr Tan,

I am very touched by what you are doing for deceived investors like me. I recognise that it take a man of great courage, leadership and tenacity to stand up for us. Never ever in my life had I faced the prospect of losing so much hand-earned savings. It hurts me tremendously because I am a frugal man.

At this darkest moment, you are there to help. I am thankful. I will always remember that you have done me a favour, at my most helpless moment.; October 08, 2008 7:43 PM
Anonymous said...: Merill Lynch Jubilee Series 3

This is a piece of shit news to me and those who are holding this note. It’s a scam and out to cheat retail investors. Why should the lost be offset from the sales proceeds of LB bonds instead of using the balance amount to return to the investors. There still some valure no matter how low it is and it should be return to the investors. What kind of mathematics is this? It should be X +Y and not X - Z ! Y is the balance amt of the underlying securities and Z is the loss after selling the securities. Why should we bear their losses when we already lost some money when the securities are sold off ?
There was no mentioned of the other 6 bonds, they did not bankurpt and should be worth some money?

The way they calculate it is no difference to robbery ! This must be the biggest cheat i have come across in my life.; October 09, 2008 8:40 AM
Anonymous said...: Yes, it’s a product that is very unfair for the investors. Let me try to illustrate it.

Noteholders put up $1million. The money is used to buy securities.

Issuer buys bonds of $1million of the 6 reference entities (or sells credit default swaps).

In return for the coupons, noteholders agree to give issuer the $1million of securities should there be any default. Issuer will give the defaulted $1 million bond to noteholders.

A defaulted bond might be worth only $300,000. The noteholder will get that and hand over $1million in securities.

The problem now is the writedown of the securities. If the securities are only worth $800,000, then you have to make up for the $200,000 drop. Thus, you only get back $100,000.

In the Jubilee 3 case, the drop in value of the underlying securities is much higher than the worth of the defaulted bond, thus there is nothing left to take back.

Unfortunately, all these scenario would have been explained in the prospectus.; October 09, 2008 8:41 AM
Anonymous said...: The unfairness of it all. All this was never explained by the FIs through their RMs. The public must be educated never to touch any structured deposits. The products are evil and devised to the benefit of the FIs and the issuer only. They may be marketed that principal is protected at maturity, but examine the small print following. Laws must be made to protect the public. After all would anyone knowingly risk all just to have 3 to 5% interest pa.; October 09, 2008 8:42 AM
Anonymous said...: 国际会计师公会香港分会建议，香港特区政府应牵头成立一个40亿港元（约7亿6000万新元）的“金融产品赔偿基金”，优先向购买了雷曼迷你债券的长者、退休人士、无业者及单亲家庭，发还最多投资金额50%的本金，以解决近期因雷曼迷你债券事件而引起的政治风波。; October 09, 2008 12:21 PM
Anonymous said...: Mr Tan, all thse affected ones & their familes cannot thank you enough for your continuous effort to help us.

Why not print out more handouts so that all can pass to our friends.

Many Thanks; October 09, 2008 5:36 PM
Anonymous said...: S'poreans want securities probe

THE former chief of a Singapore insurance cooperative delivered a petition on Thursday with almost 1,000 names demanding an independent inquiry into the sale of credit-linked securities, he told AFP.

'I confirm that the petition has been delivered to MAS (Monetary Authority of Singapore) this morning,' said Mr Tan Kin Lian, former chief executive officer of NTUC Income, a life and general insurance cooperative.

He did not comment further.

On his blog, he said the petition had 983 names asking that white collar crime police investigators and/or the MAS regulatory body conduct 'a full and independent inquiry' in relation to the sale of credit-linked securities by financial institutions in Singapore.

He said these included 'Lehman Minibonds' and 'Merrill Lynch Jubilee Notes'. US investment bank Lehman Brothers collapsed last month and its counterpart Merrill Lynch was bought out in a Wall Street meltdown that accelerated a global credit crisis.

'Singaporeans, including the persons who have signed this petition, lost their hard-earned savings by investing in these financial products. Such products clearly did not suit the risk profiles of these consumers,' Mr Tan said in the blog.

'We ask the government to act now and restore the peoples' faith in our financial system.'

The MAS managing director Heng Swee Keat said last week he understood 'the high level of anxiety' investors in some structured products were feeling.

'Our immediate focus is on helping investors to get a quick and fair resolution of their complaints,' he said.

MAS said it has assigned three prominent individuals to review the internal complaints-handling and resolution processes of the financial institutions involved.

'Where there are breaches of regulations by the financial institutions, we will take action,' Mr Heng said.

MAS said it considers 'fundamentally sound' its current regime for marketing of investment products but will undertake a review in light of recent developments in Singapore and elsewhere.

In Hong Kong on Wednesday, furious investors clashed with police outside the Bank of China's local headquarters and demanded the repayment of investments linked to Lehman Brothers.; October 09, 2008 8:32 PM
Anonymous said...: Let this be the start of our collective action, our show of anger and demand for justice. The FIs must take measures now to calm the public by making fair compensation. This will not affect very much of their bottom line I believe. If not, the consequence could be worse when the public lose their confidence and respect for our FIs and the banking system as a whole. This is a wake-up call, not too late to act.; October 09, 2008 10:36 PM
Anonymous said...: Thank you Mr Tan. Todate even MPs or the Parliamentary Committee are quiet about all these, Why. Could it be these committee members are in FI and afraid to voice up for the people. How sad. If it is a problem or 'innocent mistake' made by our regulator in approving these products and there maybe more to come or our authorities just wanting to 'ignore' the problem please admit it. We are 'wasting' a lot of productive time if only our regulatory authorities know what they are doing and take full responsibility rather than ignore it based on their reply in the media. Will it help just appointing independant person? I doubt in Singapore context. Maybe they are sitting in their seat not knowing what they are doing and what to do. Mr Tan maybe you should be in their seat instead. Sat session should invite foreign media to let them know being 1st in everything how we handle such situation. Even our local media are afriad to let the public know of Sat. I can anticipate your session will create history for the Speakers Corner in turnout. Maybe our PM or Finance Minister should come forward and have dialog on that day to give the audience and singaporeans the assuarance since our regulator unable to give the people assurance.; October 10, 2008 6:07 AM
Anonymous said...: Dear Mr Tan
Sat session besides addressing the current issues, I hope you and Sze Hian can cover other products which are currently being marketted by FIs eg the much talk of the next impact will be the funds for so called high net worth since a lot of retirees maybe in these category and even in view of the credit crunch in US, are other form of investments eg LAND BANKING, WINE etc affected. We really need professionals like you to 'stirr' a 'wake up' call to safe guard singaporeans hard earned money. I know of friend who to date unable to sell her LAND Banking after 10 years. We may 'hurt' businesses but consumer interest need to be protected. In this arena, CASE is very quiet. Surprisingly!!; October 10, 2008 6:48 AM
Invest SGX said...: You are doing the right thing.

Eventhough I have not invested in these products, I don't want the big fish to eat the small fish and pretending nothing happen.; October 10, 2008 7:49 AM
Anonymous said...: very sorry that I could not attend due to oversea at the scheduled time. But can you put video up on Youtube for people like me who could not attend?; October 10, 2008 12:00 PM
Anonymous said...: hello Mr Tan,

Thanks for your support for ordinary folks (like me).
Regret I cant go and listen to your speech (working oversea now), I sincerely support you.
Cheers !!!

Thanks again for your help on my child's policy while you're Income CEO, you're a great man.; October 10, 2008 5:48 PM
Anonymous said...: Dear Mr Tan,

I thank you for providing your knowledge to help out the commoners expecially those who are not english educated. You are truely a SINGAPORE hero who stand up to help during this crisis, unlike others with equivalent or better knowledge who just sit behind their chairs and wait for the whole saga to settle.

Latest news from South China Morning Post 10/10/08 - "DBS Hong Kong might pay full compensation to Lehman Minibond investors if they can prove they were mislead during the sales process."

Jia You; October 10, 2008 7:17 PM
Anonymous said...: Big thank you for your leadership. You have no fear because you have helped the innocents with no personal gains.

Hey, we are loosing our LIFE SAVINGS - the monies that we exhange with our life's time and efforts!

We have RIGHTS TO VOICE OUR GRIEVANCES. We are NOT SLAVES.; October 11, 2008 12:48 AM
Anonymous said...: Dear Mr Tan
Is HEDGE FUNDS and LAND BANKING another 'time bomb'. If yes, I hope this can be highlighted as a lot of FI and FAs are promoting them as as we know our regulator will not bother until it 'explodes'.
Tonight, you will definitely have a huge record turnout at the Speakers Corner since it first started
Keep up and will pray for good weather; October 11, 2008 7:31 AM
Andrew said...: Hi KL

Well done for the common good of the the vast majority of Singaporeans.

Keep up your spirit, energy and strength.

Warmest regards

Andrew Kuan; October 11, 2008 10:06 AM
Anonymous said...: Mr Tan,

THEN:
I was trust the low yield investment because:
1) The monies go to the 6 well known entities
2) it should be capital safe investment as I am required to stay invested for 7 years like a fixed deposit
3) My Risk profile assessed by my bank's RM said "My principal should be 100% safe". I trusted the Bank RM's recommendation.

NOW:
Traumatised because:
1) Little known Lehmans can affect the capital. Why FI said nothing earlier?
2) How can a risky investment can demand investor to STAY COMMITTED for SEVEN YEARS!
3) Why "My principal should be 100% safe" now not safe?

My Life Savings (my life's time and efforts) diminished in just 1 year!; October 11, 2008 10:43 AM
Anonymous said...: I suggest we all bring umbrella to Hong Lim Green. It seems like going to rain soon...which is the better way to go there ? anyone have better suggestion ?; October 11, 2008 3:35 PM
Anonymous said...: i think that losing money is your own misjudement. how can you blame the banks?

more info on my blog...; October 19, 2008 10:05 AM

Sunday, October 05, 2008

Speaker's Corner, Saturday 11 October, 5 - 7 pm

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