Tan Kin Lian's Blog: Seminars on financial risks associated with financial instruments

Friday, November 07, 2008

Seminars on financial risks associated with financial instruments

Dear Mr. Tan Kin Lian,

There are opportunities for affected structured products investors to learn more about the financial risks associated with financial instruments sold by banks and securities institutions.

The Risk Management Institute of NUS is hosting a series of public seminars on "Enhancing Financial Risk Management Knowledge". These lectures are free of charge and are open to the general public.

These seminars are held in English and Mandarin between 10 to 22 Dec 2008. For more details, please click on the direct links below.

English Seminars:
http://www.rmi.nus.edu.sg/events/public%20lectures/efrmk/PL%20-%20English.pdf

Mandarin Seminars:
http://www.rmi.nus.edu.sg/events/public%20lectures/efrmk/PL%20-%20Chinese.pdf

The events are held here:
http://www.rmi.nus.edu.sg/events/public%20lectures/index.html

Maybe, the investors can learn about what have not been told to us by the relationship managers, sales associates and securities brokers from consumer banks, independent advisory and securities institutions.

Alfred Tan

22 comments:

Anonymous said...: Even after attending the seminar and understanding it correctly or even convinced that it may be good, I will still not buy any such products from FIs. Tell me, who would?; November 07, 2008 9:30 AM
ym said...: i suggest to avoid these theory seminars -

pretty sure they talk abt "Value-at-Risk", "normal distribution" etc and they will probably say "this is a 1 in xxx year event that aig,leh broke"...

remember RMI NUS churn out plenty of financial engineers over the past few years...

btw,.. soon singapore will be bailing out las vegas sands..
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=aFUbHOT6KdeI&refer=home

the stupidiest projects are always pursued in the bubbliest times..; November 07, 2008 9:38 AM
Anonymous said...: There is no need to attend as I am sure that none of the investors will buy anymore products in their lifetime.; November 07, 2008 10:04 AM
Anonymous said...: U can "educate" and "educate" and "educate" and "educate" till pigs fly.
But sadly, the majority of average Singaporeans are just not matured/sophisticated enough to understand or would even bother to try to understand.
All these people want to know is;
1. can make money or not?
2. is it safe or not?

In another 10-20 years time, all this "structured deposit" crisis would have been forgotten. And there would be another type of "investment" scheme, follow by another crisis, follow by another round of howling.

td; November 07, 2008 10:26 AM
zhummmeng said...: After attending these seminars DON"T think that you already know these products. At the best you know the financial terms to allow you to engage in some smart conversation so that you don't look idiotic.You still need help when investing but you are able to ask some questions but NOT MAKING INFORMED DECISION.You still need the adviser to tell you whether the product is suitable for you or not.This is the advice the advisers, RMs or insurance agents must bear responsibility and NOT caveat emptor. This is the advisory process the advisers have to conduct.
The organiser should have a caveat on this.
I can't stand MAS deputy chairman who said that public education, MONEYSENSE, on finance can turn a layman into an investor who can make informed decision. He is terribly wrong and misrepresented the public awareness education.Is he trying to shift responsibility or risk to the investors? Investors mustn't be lulled into a false sense that the little knowledge is already enough to let them DIY.
Remember your right to responsible and competent advice from your advisers.; November 07, 2008 10:28 AM
Anonymous said...: zhummmeng
The crux of the matter is;
Is the advice given by the adviser more skewed towards his own commission goals or towards the benefit of the layman?

td; November 07, 2008 10:41 AM
Anonymous said...: I think the RM's is the one needs to be trained to present pros and cons, target the right group of customers, be customer oriented and most importantly have a kind and just hearts.

HS; November 07, 2008 11:27 AM
Anonymous said...: It's the people giving the RMs the monthly target. Unfortunately, it's all about $$$$$$ in this world.; November 07, 2008 12:42 PM
zhummmeng said...: td,
it depends. If you have an adviser who doesn't have your interest at heart and doesn't conduct your need analysis then the process might be skewed to the adviser's interest.
Secondly, the fact find form can tell whether the advsier has done a proper job according to steps as prescribed by the law.The law protects the consumers if the adviser is found to have recommended a product that is not of reasonable basis,ie not according to your needs and circumstances he or she is said to have breached section 27 of the FAA.
Choosing an adviser is important but alas like the product you don't know who is honest and competent...
Therefore it is MAS's
duty to ensure that the RMs, consultants and insurance agents don't push product but use a need based approach to your needs.MAS must ban product selling and make need based compulsory. MAS must also actively enforce this law and the law that regulates products.I am not saying this will eradicate msi-selling and misrepresntation but certainly will reduce. With stringent enforcement and punishment this will deter FIs and their reps from willfully commiting the misconduct.; November 07, 2008 12:48 PM
Anonymous said...: Attend Financial seminars!
Not in my life time please!
Once bitten twice shy!
Cantonese saying " Don't see coffin, don't know how to shed tears!

Rgds
Victimised investor; November 07, 2008 2:08 PM
Anonymous said...: I think the RM's were also conned to believe that the products were safe, low risk and well diversified. Thus they target that group of customers.

They must have based on the assumption that was available in the promotional materials and brochures.

Take any promotional materials and compare to the pricing statement. They don't match.
The promotional materials are design to mis-lead investors to think that these are high quality product. I believe all RMs also don't read the pricing statement of all products that they are selling.
Even if they read, it would be doubtful that they can understand. Even people with financial background also cannot understand.

The pricing statement is designed to cover up and protect the bank as the bank knows these product are toxic which only the bank lawyers can read.

Both investors and RMs are victims. Investor lose $.
RMs (who based on promotional materials to sell )will get the blame and lose their job.

Only All FIs are winner.
They get to sell toxic waste and well protected no matter what they sell.

Any RMs willing to provide any promotional materials that they usually keep in their personal black folders to MAS and let them compare with the pricing statement to investigate whether FIs purposely design these products and promotional materials intentionally to mis-lead and cheat?

I bet all my money that MAS can easily find many evidences that FIs have clearly flouted some laws, Acts or whatever you call them.
Oops....cannot bet, no more money. all kanna cheated by FI already.; November 07, 2008 2:31 PM
Anonymous said...: Lets not forget that the RMs can be our children, nephews, nieces, children of our friends.. even our spouses. These are the young people who studied finance, banking, insurance or even engineering who found work in FIs for a career. I think many of them do not really know the risks and just followed the marketing scripts when selling the products -- or were they driven just by commission and the targets set?

Very soon, as our young enrol in courses related to the casino business and the older worker retrain themselves to get into this sector, they will be promoting gambling and related entertainment products to us all when the casinos open. They will be asked to target those who have savings... Be prepared for this day.

While we are now asking the FIs, the MAS .. to do the right thing, we have to also teach our young at home to have the right values and ethics and to do the right thing...and that we cannot make money without considering the interest of your client.; November 07, 2008 5:43 PM
Anonymous said...: Anomnymous 5.43pm,
What you do one must be guided by values.Without values you will succumb to all sorts of temptation.
I know of a few RMs and insurance agents who quit because of conflict of values. They settle for lesser pay jobs but professional and they are very happy.
Don't think those agents who qualify for MDRT or TOT are great. Most of them if not all are despicable product pushers and cheats. Their production cannot withstand scrutiny.Their productions bordered on mis-selling and misrepresentation and some on immoral. So don't envy them. They are nothing but salesmen and women who make a living at the expense of their clients who don't even know they are taken for a ride.The reason why these agents can prey on consumers because most of them are ignorant or pretend to know.
The problem with this ill is commission. It is the cause of greed, unethical and immoral practices and any malpractices you can think. It has turned nice people into monsters.

ex agent; November 07, 2008 6:45 PM
Anonymous said...: My strongest advice is as per that of the blog owner

Go and learn something. Anything. Please; November 08, 2008 11:43 AM
adego said...: there is conflict of interest.

The school is teaching financial engineering, they are not going to tell us any crappy things about it. if they do, they will be redundant very soon.

btw, those who ae teachable, they don't have to attend, bcos they've already learn about it by now

those who are not well verse in such things will not bother to attend. simplest thing is to do, is to avoid such product.

there is no point holding such lecture for now. banks are axing investment banking related positions. there will be over-supply, becos the demand for such product will fall very drastically for the next few years.

since the take up rate for such product will slow, the vicious cycle will continue, and the excess will be removed by the market forces.

i.e. supply / demand

and very soon, the investment bankers' job is not going to offer such high salary as before, and it will no longer be the most aspired profession. pple just follow the money.

and there will be some new idea/products arriving the market places... and for a while it is making a whirlwind, and pple are loving it... and just 1 event take place and spill the beans... the cycle continue itself again... and again...; November 08, 2008 9:46 PM
Concerned said...: Once bitten, whole life shy. Avoid such products at all cost.
Never go near such products no matter who attractive it may be package. It may be another con job again; November 09, 2008 12:56 PM
Anonymous said...: Hey, the FIs need to attend these talks, and also our MAS and gahmen. So they can understand how the product really works and stop spew insensitive remarks at the victims of this saga !!; November 09, 2008 5:40 PM
Anonymous said...: adego,
are you telling us you are a thief too.Please speak for yourself. Don't put us together with thief like you.
We are not greedy. For 5% ? you are nuts and desperado and maybe yuo are greedy. For us it is prudent..; November 09, 2008 9:26 PM
adego said...: some ppl has smaller greed, some has bigger.

sometimes, unfortunately small greed caused big trouble...

why live in self-denial mode? be it small or bigger greed, it is GREED.

greed exist in almost every soul, any religions' followers, colors, regions etc. (despite the teachings against greed)

check with the master of philosophy, they will tell u more about greed; November 09, 2008 10:47 PM
Anonymous said...: adego,

ADEGO is great, no GREED!
ADEGO is SAGE and all the ppl here are THIEVES stealing the GREED from adego.

How do I see U different from Lorna Tan the silly girl who did a cut & paste job with a heap of rubbish (ST Sun, 9 Nov 08 Page 26 invest)?

a 50 steps laughing at the 100 steps.
*sigh!; November 09, 2008 11:15 PM
zhummmeng said...: Attending seminars does not make you an expert or savvy enough to DIY your investment and neither helps you to make informed decision. Don't be fooled by MAS that you can. MAS is avoiding the responsibility of enforcement . MAS may be helping the FIs by providing a way out for FIs and their reps in the event of a failed investment.
Attending investment seminars or talks only helps to build up your investment vocabulary and to help you ask some smart questions and to engage or follow a conversation.
Making an informed decision is a joke. If investors can , there is no need for advisers or RMs or insurance agents.Just conduct mass public education.Why pay them? Buy at a discount your insurance and investment funds and save up to 2.5 years of premium for insurance and at least 10% of fees for funds.; November 09, 2008 11:17 PM
Anonymous said...: I realized CPFIS (CPF Investment Schedule) has a risk classification system. Financial Products not approved under CPFIS are probably very very high risk that CPF do not recommended.

Lesson Learned : dont buy anything that is not approved under CPFIS.; November 11, 2008 9:50 PM