Tan Kin Lian's Blog: How I was misled (3)

Thursday, November 20, 2008

How I was misled (3)

Dear Mr. Tan
I wish I had read your blog before purchasing my pinnacle notes series 6 last year.

The picture painted by the sales representative was so good, I was convinced it was a great investment. I even encouraged my two daughters to invest their hard earned savings, something I have not stopped regretting since the downturn.

On hindsight, I should have realised that there were some things that were not so right. The prospectus was not shown to me although it was sent to me much later, by post, after I had closed the deal. I tried to read it, but the technicality floored me. So many pages of fine print. The copies of the agreement were not sent to me either.

When I called the representative's mobile, he didn't answer my calls. Then I called his office at H and discovered that he had left. Subsequently, the manager very kindly did a trace and delivered the copies by hand to me. By then I had managed to read some of the stuff in the prospectus and realised that I could lose all my money as it was not capital protected. It was too late to do anything except pray, but it looks like prayers didn't help.

I don't know if there is anything left of what we invested. Is there anything that can be done? I have left out the names of the people as I don't know if I should at this stage. I hope you can help in some ways.
Sincerely,

Mary

17 comments:

G C said...: You are not only one that have been mis led in this manner. They are many many who I believe was being lead to believe that these structured products are superior alternative to the conventional FDs.

Therefore they are as save as FD and superior in the sense that the return is much higher than FD rate.

The reason that the FI and the RM representing them was so keen to market them must have some thing to tell. It is for the regulators to find out.

I was very sadden in deed by this fiasco. Many other have keep blaming the greediness of the investors. And many other also blame why you invest with out your eye open.

One must accept the responsibility is there is any mis selling and there is no pint to keep blaming and spent the resources to find out who to be blame but should instead focus on what was actually happen and what exactly role being play by the FIs in marketing these structured products? How mush the FIS and the RM know the nature and features of these products? How these information are being explained to the investors? Why there were so many cases of the investors were led to forgone FD and took these products as alternative and a superior one?

All these are basis questions that only the regulators can go to find an answer.

Once mistake done it have to admit in the first place and solutions find and rectify them in order to proceed other wise all the losses and the pain suffer by the many will not be a lesson well learn.

G C Tham; November 20, 2008 8:14 AM
Anonymous said...: u should approach the bank or financial institution that sold the product to u and lodge a complaint on mis-selling. let them investigate into ur case and hopefully they will be fair and make right what was previously done wrong. hopefully, they will be able to refund ur investment money to u. at least there is the chance if u make a complaint.; November 20, 2008 9:35 AM
Anonymous said...: They Master of Con, hire par time seller call RM.; November 20, 2008 9:59 AM
Anonymous said...: I have lost $95K over Pinnacle Notes Series 6 overnight. Until now, I still do not know what have gone wrong. The RM is equally blurred or act blurred. It is a very expensive lesson. Left with very few years to recoup the lost, hopefully.

Old Retiree; November 20, 2008 10:08 AM
Anonymous said...: Our world class A team leaders are too shy to admit mistakes. Therefore push all the blames to the RMs and investors.

But they are not shy to demand for salary increment from millions to millions.

They have forgotten that the government has the social responsibility to protect its citizens.

Zhong; November 20, 2008 11:17 AM
Anonymous said...: HI,

THIS IS A CLASSIC CASE OF NOT BEING MISLED!!!
HOW CAN YOU SIGN ANYTHING WITHOUT READING THE PROSPECTUS FIRST??????
WHETHER U ARE BUYING A CAR, A HOUSE, OR A INSURANCE POLICY YOU MUST READ THE NECESSARY DOCUMENTS FIRST. IF YOU CHOSE TO TRUST THE BANKER, THEN, IT'S YOUR BUSINESS.
SORRY,I CAN ONLY SAY YOU DESERVED IT.; November 20, 2008 6:18 PM
Anonymous said...: "Anonymous Anonymous said...

HI,

THIS IS A CLASSIC CASE OF NOT BEING MISLED!!!
HOW CAN YOU SIGN ANYTHING WITHOUT READING THE PROSPECTUS FIRST??????
WHETHER U ARE BUYING A CAR, A HOUSE, OR A INSURANCE POLICY YOU MUST READ THE NECESSARY DOCUMENTS FIRST. IF YOU CHOSE TO TRUST THE BANKER, THEN, IT'S YOUR BUSINESS.
SORRY,I CAN ONLY SAY YOU DESERVED IT.

6:18 PM"

You got everything wrong!

The wrong is that you put everything in bold.; November 20, 2008 8:04 PM
Anonymous said...: While I believed there are some people who are misled..there are also many who went in with their eyes open but now claiming they are misled. Why? becos of greed. High interest rates!!! Do you think they will bother to reconsider the risk even if the risk is fully explaind to them ? I don't think so..especially when they purchase the products at a time when the global economy is rosy...thinking that it is very safe. Even if they are aware of the existing risk as fully explained to them ..I dare say many buyers will still just go ahead and invest in the products becos to them, the likelihood of a credit event taking place is very very slim. Never mind..just take a risk..the interest rate is too attractive to forgo.
There is a lesson to be learned here. One should alway remember that there is no free lunch...high return alway comes with high risk. Everybody knows that. If the product is so risk free.. you won't be getting such a high interest rate. Think about it. There's always a catch. Even as a shopper we alway come across free gifts of great value. But to get them...you will need to spend a minimal sum..which most likely will include at least the cost of the free gifts..so essentially, you are paying for the free gifts as well.

Now everyone is claiming to have been misled..just wonder how the banks are going to differentiate between those who are genuinely misled and those who join in to cry foul when in the first place they enter into the purchase knowing fully well the inherent risk involved.; November 20, 2008 9:20 PM
Anonymous said...: 9:20 PM

My advice to U is: Shut up!

Do find time to understand what are CDS (Credit default swap), Synthetic CDO & Synthetic CDO Squared Transations etc.

MAS, Stat Boards, TC MPs & their fund managers, those professors including Dean of Business Faculty and professionals in many industries are NOT STUPID but all get CONNED.

Go & study WHY they WALK IN with EYES OPEN but can not SEE the light.

DO not produce heap of rubbish! It merely reflects your ignorance & lack of knowledge.

U really create a good joke in "when in the first place they enter into the purchase knowing fully well the inherent risk involved." not even the professors in Business & Law field dare to say that they know fully well the inherent risk involved in the 'Credit-linked' structured product.; November 20, 2008 11:38 PM
Anonymous said...: The truth is that our FIs are the main culprits for bringing in the products and in one case for designing and packaging them. Even before the investors get their additional annual ~3% interest, the FIs had already pocketed more than 20%.

Talk about GREED! Who is more greedy?

Can the FIs honestly state that they told the investors that besides the 6 to 8 REs, they are also "investing" in another 100s of UFOs and that 1 failure (may be a default in loan payment) in 1 RE or a few in the 100s UFOs could mean 100% loss in investment?

If they did, am sure no one will buy the products - take 100% risk for ~3% more in interest over a period of 4 to 7 years.

By hiding the material fact (VERY HIGH RISK), who is the greedy one?

So for those who are quick to accuse us of being greedy, please get your full facts!!

Hmmm.. or maybe they are paid to come here to create trouble and discredit the people here....; November 21, 2008 2:12 AM
Anonymous said...: Hello
In my opinion there is no need to understand all these CDOs stuffs. An investor could assess the risk on the basis of the bank reputation. That means, if the investor thinks says, hey, the big banks are experts and should be able to handle any CDOs stuffs and cover thier own backsides so that they wouldnt collapse. Ordinary folk has no business to figure out CDOs. Ordinary folk can simply purchase on the basis of their trust in the 6 banks solid reputation of several hundred years. So how can the RM who sold to you be blamed for it? The only way to blame the RMs and FI's is if you can prove to them that they told you "if one bank collapse you still have the other 5 in the basket". I mentioned many times this idea, but not a single comment from anyone. Either i am talking rubbish or i am saying a truth nobody wants to challenge.
REX; November 21, 2008 3:00 PM
Anonymous said...: As an ex-RM and feedbacks from fellow Rms, I can only say that we ourselves are the scrap-goats in this crisis.

Reasons because we were push by Senior Mgmt to sell more and you think that Junior staffs like us will understand everything in just 2-3hrs of training?

It's the Senior Mgmt who pushes hard plus the person who invented the products that are cheating the public.

They are the one that make the most $$$.; November 21, 2008 5:20 PM
Anonymous said...: I refer to the RM who posted the comment at 5:20 PM.
I salute you for being honest. I always believe that when ones did something wrong and own up is the hero.
Hope you can help all the victims who have lost their life saving by telling MAS about the training that you RMs have. (2-3 hrs????) to sell such toxic product.; November 21, 2008 11:52 PM
Anonymous said...: I refer to the anonymous posted the blog at 6:18 pm on header
"THIS IS A CLASSIC CASE OF NOT BEING MISLED!!!"

You go and f spider. Hope that you get cheated one day. The whole world will say "you deserve it".
Please pray hard.; November 22, 2008 12:02 AM
Anonymous said...: 9:20 PM

High risk High return and low risk mean low return, U mean only the o man and U know best.

LB Minibond 1-8, ML Jubilee 3, DBS HN5 & MS Pinnacle CLN 9 & 10 are all worthless now. ALL THESE strurctured products are "Credit-linked" stuctured products and all pegged to a basket of 100 to 150 corporate named "Synthetic CDOs". There are two IRs or rather two CASINO the note holders are misled and walked in with their EYES OPEN. 1st CASINO the one of FTD(First-to-default) robbed all your capital in the case of DBS HN5 and the CASINO boss is our Nat Bank. ML Jubilee 3 noters were robbed on the same day but by the AMOH banker. The second CASINO the one with Sythetic CDOs with a fantastic mathematical model created by the world's no 1 mathematics genius sucked away all your capital by AMOH too in the case of Pinnacle CLN 9 & 10. TAKE NOTE that these are the 'Credit-link notes' that are the focus. Do not argue like Dr Teo H P that nobody expected LB to collapse. LB's collapse does have that effect to the failure of many CLNs but they are many other LB size giants collapsed too or about to collapse.

All these will affect not only the CLN, but other strurctured products as the credit crunch will affect the market sentiment and the price of equity. eg. ELN. PS 8,11,12,15 & 16 are ELN (Equity-linked note). LB minibond 9 & 10 are something else (linked ot floating note). ML JB 8 is another type of instrument too. There are many more strurctured products in the market that no one know what they are.

Do not link the CLN saga to stock trading which is so much simple in comparison?

In short, no ordinary people who is elaborated on how the mechanism of the 'credit-linked' security works will buy it other than is 'misrepresented' to believe it is a FD & bond type product.

Hope U can learn more surfing this blog!; November 22, 2008 1:40 PM
Anonymous said...: Can anybody advise me what about all the others notes in future?Like in my case of DBS High Notes 10, myY RM and FI told me how can you expect Reference entity 'Capital Land to Collapse? Is this true?I was told that in any case, if anything happens to CL, CL will pay High Notes first. They assure me CL is also another Name of DBS land. I really don't know about other entity CDS, CDO's etc.Frankly,to me, all this are like jokes to me. I have never betted 4D or Totto in my life so far and I am NOT ready to loose anything and don't believe in Luck. Somehow, this RM convinced me about this high risk product, which to me, which I thought was FD or Goverment Bond.It was also entrusted to DBS as National Bank. Last week,to my horror, I found that my High Notes 10 Bank notes has lowered to a value 85%.I couldn't reach my RM who is long vacation leave with my sales commission may be. I dont mind to loose 15% but 100% is definitely out of question. This is my children education savings.Can any one genuinely advise me on what i should do? Pls;; November 23, 2008 1:41 AM
Anonymous said...: TO Anonymous(1.41am)

Your RM is not wrong by saying "CapitalLand to collapse" but he is using the current state of CL. Can anyone knows what will happen to CL in 3,4 or 10 years time?

Look at Lehman Bros, a company with AAA ratings and AIG. One collapse and other nearly. Today's paper mentioning Citibank.

15% losses better than 100% losses.; November 25, 2008 3:36 PM